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	<title>Comments on: Ed Miliband: Dangerous Revolutionary?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://thoughcowardsflinch.com/2010/07/27/ed-miliband-dangerous-revolutionary/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://thoughcowardsflinch.com/2010/07/27/ed-miliband-dangerous-revolutionary/</link>
	<description>&#34;We know what happens to people who stay in the middle of the road. They get run down&#34; - Aneurin Bevan, 1953</description>
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		<title>By: raincoatoptimism</title>
		<link>http://thoughcowardsflinch.com/2010/07/27/ed-miliband-dangerous-revolutionary/#comment-13974</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[raincoatoptimism]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jul 2010 08:42:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thoughcowardsflinch.com/?p=3967#comment-13974</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I often ignore the bloggers with huge readership]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I often ignore the bloggers with huge readership</p>
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		<title>By: James Doran</title>
		<link>http://thoughcowardsflinch.com/2010/07/27/ed-miliband-dangerous-revolutionary/#comment-13968</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[James Doran]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jul 2010 07:36:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thoughcowardsflinch.com/?p=3967#comment-13968</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Ah, Lenin - whatever happened to patiently explaining ;-)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ah, Lenin &#8211; whatever happened to patiently explaining <img src='http://s1.wp.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: lenin</title>
		<link>http://thoughcowardsflinch.com/2010/07/27/ed-miliband-dangerous-revolutionary/#comment-13967</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[lenin]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jul 2010 07:27:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thoughcowardsflinch.com/?p=3967#comment-13967</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[A tip: not everyone who has a blog is worth responding to.  This guy is, what, a &#039;consultant&#039; in some capacity?  A fucking mediocrity off and online, who probably had about two readers before you sent traffic his way?  He&#039;s a moron and a massive bluffer (like he knows the first thing about sociology or what Ralph Miliband stood for).  Ignore him.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A tip: not everyone who has a blog is worth responding to.  This guy is, what, a &#8216;consultant&#8217; in some capacity?  A fucking mediocrity off and online, who probably had about two readers before you sent traffic his way?  He&#8217;s a moron and a massive bluffer (like he knows the first thing about sociology or what Ralph Miliband stood for).  Ignore him.</p>
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		<title>By: James Doran</title>
		<link>http://thoughcowardsflinch.com/2010/07/27/ed-miliband-dangerous-revolutionary/#comment-13956</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[James Doran]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jul 2010 01:26:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thoughcowardsflinch.com/?p=3967#comment-13956</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Comrade White quotes my blogpost on &quot;Next Labour&quot; - the challenge that the other Miliband brother has laid down for us to consider (http://hands-of-the-many.blogspot.com/2010/05/next-labour-will-change-be-moderate-or.html).

Far from being a Bennite, Ed Miliband has the backing of notable moderates like Luke Akehurst (http://lukeakehurst.blogspot.com/) and John Gray (http://grayee.blogspot.com). Far from being a Blairite, David Miliband&#039;s radicalism includes support for a British Investment Bank (a Labour policy during the late 80s / early 90s), living wage campaigns, and reform to company law to give ordinary workers representation on remuneration committees. His recent speech on job creation and industrial policy could just as easily have been made by Ed (http://www.davidmiliband.net/2010/07/24/reducing-the-jobs-deficit/)

So, I have been cautioning against people using the spatial metaphors of left, right, and centre - and urging instead that we talk about the interests that are at stake. For people on modest to middle incomes there is a common interest in defending public services - we should therefore have no truck with talk of left/right etc., because it avoids the issues that lost our party votes. That Ed rather than David has the backing of trade union executives owes more to the younger brother not being so closely associated with the New Labour project than substantive policy difference from his brother.

The view that was held of the Labour Party by people it needed to win in the early nineties no longer exists. Times have changed - where once people might have entertained the idea that industrial militancy caused economic woes, since the financial crisis more people see the greed and recklessness of those at the top as a problem.

My hopes for this leadership contest were that it would advance the party&#039;s approach beyond acceptance of the existing power relations towards greater democratic control by ordinary people (http://hands-of-the-many.blogspot.com/2010/05/on-future-of-labour.html).]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Comrade White quotes my blogpost on &#8220;Next Labour&#8221; &#8211; the challenge that the other Miliband brother has laid down for us to consider (<a href="http://hands-of-the-many.blogspot.com/2010/05/next-labour-will-change-be-moderate-or.html" rel="nofollow">http://hands-of-the-many.blogspot.com/2010/05/next-labour-will-change-be-moderate-or.html</a>).</p>
<p>Far from being a Bennite, Ed Miliband has the backing of notable moderates like Luke Akehurst (<a href="http://lukeakehurst.blogspot.com/" rel="nofollow">http://lukeakehurst.blogspot.com/</a>) and John Gray (<a href="http://grayee.blogspot.com" rel="nofollow">http://grayee.blogspot.com</a>). Far from being a Blairite, David Miliband&#8217;s radicalism includes support for a British Investment Bank (a Labour policy during the late 80s / early 90s), living wage campaigns, and reform to company law to give ordinary workers representation on remuneration committees. His recent speech on job creation and industrial policy could just as easily have been made by Ed (<a href="http://www.davidmiliband.net/2010/07/24/reducing-the-jobs-deficit/" rel="nofollow">http://www.davidmiliband.net/2010/07/24/reducing-the-jobs-deficit/</a>)</p>
<p>So, I have been cautioning against people using the spatial metaphors of left, right, and centre &#8211; and urging instead that we talk about the interests that are at stake. For people on modest to middle incomes there is a common interest in defending public services &#8211; we should therefore have no truck with talk of left/right etc., because it avoids the issues that lost our party votes. That Ed rather than David has the backing of trade union executives owes more to the younger brother not being so closely associated with the New Labour project than substantive policy difference from his brother.</p>
<p>The view that was held of the Labour Party by people it needed to win in the early nineties no longer exists. Times have changed &#8211; where once people might have entertained the idea that industrial militancy caused economic woes, since the financial crisis more people see the greed and recklessness of those at the top as a problem.</p>
<p>My hopes for this leadership contest were that it would advance the party&#8217;s approach beyond acceptance of the existing power relations towards greater democratic control by ordinary people (<a href="http://hands-of-the-many.blogspot.com/2010/05/on-future-of-labour.html" rel="nofollow">http://hands-of-the-many.blogspot.com/2010/05/on-future-of-labour.html</a>).</p>
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		<title>By: Dave Semple</title>
		<link>http://thoughcowardsflinch.com/2010/07/27/ed-miliband-dangerous-revolutionary/#comment-13927</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Dave Semple]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Jul 2010 16:31:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thoughcowardsflinch.com/?p=3967#comment-13927</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[A key query here is whether there is room for an old-style social democracy any longer, without some wider change and mass mobilisation the likes of which Ed Miliband will (if safely ensconced at the top of the Labour Party) likely oppose?

Perhaps - and here&#039;s a bone to Paul Cotterill - the best thing for the development of Ed Miliband&#039;s political sensibilities, as an individual, would be for him to lose the leadership contest. Maybe then he&#039;ll appreciate the need for and role of a mass movement, if that&#039;s what Labour is to return to, as so many soundbytes from the candidates seem to hint.

My iffy attitude to Miliband Jr is coined precisely by Jako, above. He is attracting people from Left and Right - not by convincing either of his capacity for a new departure but by appealing to some policies acceptable to the one and some policies acceptable to the other. And this is before he&#039;s cocooned inside the Westminster comfort zone as Leader of HM Opposition.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A key query here is whether there is room for an old-style social democracy any longer, without some wider change and mass mobilisation the likes of which Ed Miliband will (if safely ensconced at the top of the Labour Party) likely oppose?</p>
<p>Perhaps &#8211; and here&#8217;s a bone to Paul Cotterill &#8211; the best thing for the development of Ed Miliband&#8217;s political sensibilities, as an individual, would be for him to lose the leadership contest. Maybe then he&#8217;ll appreciate the need for and role of a mass movement, if that&#8217;s what Labour is to return to, as so many soundbytes from the candidates seem to hint.</p>
<p>My iffy attitude to Miliband Jr is coined precisely by Jako, above. He is attracting people from Left and Right &#8211; not by convincing either of his capacity for a new departure but by appealing to some policies acceptable to the one and some policies acceptable to the other. And this is before he&#8217;s cocooned inside the Westminster comfort zone as Leader of HM Opposition.</p>
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		<title>By: Jamie</title>
		<link>http://thoughcowardsflinch.com/2010/07/27/ed-miliband-dangerous-revolutionary/#comment-13925</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Jamie]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Jul 2010 15:53:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thoughcowardsflinch.com/?p=3967#comment-13925</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Absolutely spot on. There&#039;s an article by Patrick O&#039;Flynn in today&#039;s that expresses much the same sentiment as the blog you link to; complete nonsense. The idea that Ed Miliband is some kind Trotskyist monster just because the unions happen to prefer him over the other candidates is laughable. I agree that he is, if anything, a social democrat at heart; certainly much more accepting of capitalism and the role of the markets in the economy than the Militant left of the Labour Party three decades ever would have been. If this is all the Tory bloggers and right-wing press have to throw at this Miliband, they&#039;re going to have try a lot harder.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Absolutely spot on. There&#8217;s an article by Patrick O&#8217;Flynn in today&#8217;s that expresses much the same sentiment as the blog you link to; complete nonsense. The idea that Ed Miliband is some kind Trotskyist monster just because the unions happen to prefer him over the other candidates is laughable. I agree that he is, if anything, a social democrat at heart; certainly much more accepting of capitalism and the role of the markets in the economy than the Militant left of the Labour Party three decades ever would have been. If this is all the Tory bloggers and right-wing press have to throw at this Miliband, they&#8217;re going to have try a lot harder.</p>
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		<title>By: raincoatoptimism</title>
		<link>http://thoughcowardsflinch.com/2010/07/27/ed-miliband-dangerous-revolutionary/#comment-13921</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[raincoatoptimism]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Jul 2010 14:25:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thoughcowardsflinch.com/?p=3967#comment-13921</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Jako - when I saw your first line my heart skipped a beat, luckily for me you mean Max&#039; nonsense]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jako &#8211; when I saw your first line my heart skipped a beat, luckily for me you mean Max&#8217; nonsense</p>
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		<title>By: Jako</title>
		<link>http://thoughcowardsflinch.com/2010/07/27/ed-miliband-dangerous-revolutionary/#comment-13920</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Jako]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Jul 2010 14:19:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thoughcowardsflinch.com/?p=3967#comment-13920</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Jeez, that post you link to is pathetic. Patronising and reactionary, illogical and smallminded. None of the leadership candidates are perfect but out of all of them I&#039;m most persuaded by Ed Miliband&#039;s political analysis and the policy direction he supposedly wants to take the party in. Plus I think it&#039;s important that Ed Miliband has managed to attract supporters from both the left and right of the party. David Miliband&#039;s inability get any of the major trade unions to endorse him is worrying.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jeez, that post you link to is pathetic. Patronising and reactionary, illogical and smallminded. None of the leadership candidates are perfect but out of all of them I&#8217;m most persuaded by Ed Miliband&#8217;s political analysis and the policy direction he supposedly wants to take the party in. Plus I think it&#8217;s important that Ed Miliband has managed to attract supporters from both the left and right of the party. David Miliband&#8217;s inability get any of the major trade unions to endorse him is worrying.</p>
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		<title>By: Adam White (@theday2day)</title>
		<link>http://thoughcowardsflinch.com/2010/07/27/ed-miliband-dangerous-revolutionary/#comment-13918</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Adam White (@theday2day)]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Jul 2010 13:18:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thoughcowardsflinch.com/?p=3967#comment-13918</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[My point exactly..]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My point exactly..</p>
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		<title>By: raincoatoptimism</title>
		<link>http://thoughcowardsflinch.com/2010/07/27/ed-miliband-dangerous-revolutionary/#comment-13915</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[raincoatoptimism]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Jul 2010 13:04:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thoughcowardsflinch.com/?p=3967#comment-13915</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[No Bennite ever wanted to &quot;change&quot; capitalism, that&#039;s for sure]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No Bennite ever wanted to &#8220;change&#8221; capitalism, that&#8217;s for sure</p>
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